From: Cymru66[at]aol.com
Subject: Re: Ir-D Book Advice

Dear Paddy,
I agree that browsing in small bookstores and developing friendly
relationships with their owners is the ideal - alas, quickly disappearing.
My
purpose was not to promote Amazon but to point-out that it is the only
remaining viable alternative to the mega chains which, in cahoots with the
publishers, will be pushing us around even more in the future than they're
doing now. The Amazon alternative will not be around for long, I think. The
mega chains are already establishing themselves on the internet and they
have
the distribution networks and retail outlets which Amazon lacks - the actual
stores. So, the marketers have already coined one more of their graceless
phrases - our book shopping will in future be done through 'brick click'.
Sorry about this. You won't believe the internal struggle I went through
before actually ordering through Amazon.
Best,
John

We have had this message from

Danny McGowan
danny.mcgowan[at]unisonfree.net

I know that a number of us are following up these lines of enquiry, so that
the query is of general interest.

P.O'S.


Dear Irish Diaspora List

The Edinburgh Evening News ran a story last year which cited a British
government report in 1933, commissioned to consider deporting Irish people
who were on poor relief. The article, by a Susan Dalgety, quotes from
sections of the report, including its 'Crime and Lunacy' passages. Susan
Dalgety mentions that the 'secret government papers' were meant to be closed
for 100 years but had been released by an open government initiative.

I really need to see these papers but don't know where to find them.
Attempts to locate Susan Dalgetty have come to nothing. Can anyone help me?

Danny McGowan

From: "Maria McGarrity"
Subject: Global Contexts for Caribbean Lit Conference

Paddy,

I thought this conference might interest fellow Ir-D members who work on the
Irish in the Caribbean. A note for the revelers among us, this conference
takes place immediately after the Trinidadian Carnival.

Maria McGarrity
mmcgarrity[at]miami.edu


THE UNIVERSITY OF THE WEST INDIES
ST. AUGUSTINE, TRINIDAD & TOBAGO, WEST INDIES
FACULTY OF HUMANITIES AND EDUCATION
DEPARTMENT OF LIBERAL ARTS

ANNOUNCEMENT

20TH ANNIVERSARY

CONFERENCE ON WEST INDIAN LITERATURE

DATE: MARCH 1ST - 3RD, 2001

THEME: CARIBBEAN LITERATURE IN A GLOBAL CONTEXT

TITLES AND 300-WORD ABSTRACT DUE DECEMBER 15, 2000
PAPER DUE FEBRUARY 15, 2001

TELEPHONE: (868) 662-2002; (868) 645-2031

CONTACT: DR. FUNSO AIYEJINA EXT. 3493; DR. PAULA MORGAN EXT. 3567

CONFERENCE SECRETARY: MS. ADEL BAIN EXT. 2032

FAX: (868) 663-5059

EMAIL: LIBARTS[at]CARIB-LINK.NET

Subject: Re: Ir-D Wakes
From: Eileen A Sullivan

Paul O'Leary,

The practice of women preparing the corpse is current in Kenmare, County
Kerry. When my cousin-in-law was killed in an accident a few years ago,
it was his sister, wife of the undertaker who prepared his body.


Dr. Eileen A. Sullivan, Director
The Irish Educational Association, Inc. Tel # (352) 332
3690
6412 NW 128th Street E-Mail :
eolas1[at]juno.com
Gainesville, FL 32653

From: "joan hugman"
Subject: Re: Ir-D 1933 Report on Irish Poor

The PRO is the obvious place to look but perhaps you have already
tried that ??
Joan

Subject: Ir-D 1933 Report on Irish Poor
Date: Sun 12 Nov 2000 13:35:00 +0000



We have had this message from

Danny McGowan
danny.mcgowan[at]unisonfree.net

I know that a number of us are following up these lines of enquiry, so that
the query is of general interest.

P.O'S.


Dear Irish Diaspora List

The Edinburgh Evening News ran a story last year which cited a British
government report in 1933, commissioned to consider deporting Irish people
who were on poor relief. The article, by a Susan Dalgety, quotes from
sections of the report, including its 'Crime and Lunacy' passages. Susan
Dalgety mentions that the 'secret government papers' were meant to be closed
for 100 years but had been released by an open government initiative.

I really need to see these papers but don't know where to find them.
Attempts to locate Susan Dalgetty have come to nothing. Can anyone help me?

Danny McGowan


Joan Hugman
Department of History, Armstrong Building,
University of Newcastle NE1 7RU Tel 0191 222 6701

From: Hilary Robinson
Subject: Re: Ir-D Book Advice

- - indeed, an article this weekend in Independent (12th Nov) said that many
Waterstones shops are now refusing to see the reps from 'small' publishers,
and suggested that the smaller publishers will find life extremely hard in
future as a result:

Some small independent publishers claim they are facing bankruptcy after the
giant bookseller Waterstone's demanded huge
new discounts from them. The
chain stunned smaller publishers by giving
them just one week to accept new
terms and conditions, including a 50 per
cent discount on the cover price of any
book stocked by Waterstone's.


dismayed,
Hilary

>From: Cymru66[at]aol.com
>Subject: Re: Ir-D Book Advice
>
>Dear Paddy,
> I agree that browsing in small bookstores and developing friendly
>relationships with their owners is the ideal - alas, quickly disappearing.
>My
>purpose was not to promote Amazon but to point-out that it is the only
>remaining viable alternative to the mega chains which, in cahoots with the
>publishers, will be pushing us around even more in the future than they're
>doing now. The Amazon alternative will not be around for long, I think. The
>mega chains are already establishing themselves on the internet and they
>have
>the distribution networks and retail outlets which Amazon lacks - the
actual
>stores. So, the marketers have already coined one more of their graceless
>phrases - our book shopping will in future be done through 'brick click'.
> Sorry about this. You won't believe the internal struggle I went through
>before actually ordering through Amazon.
> Best,
> John


_______________________________

Dr. Hilary Robinson
School of Art and Design
University of Ulster at Belfast
York Street
Belfast BT15 1ED
Northern Ireland
UK


direct phone/fax: (+44) (0) 28 9026.7291)

From: Alexander Peach
Subject: RE: Ir-D 1933 Report on Irish Poor

I do not know anything about secret papers from the 1930s but it sounds to
me as though the quote could well have been written 100 years earlier in
the Report from the Select Committee on Irish Vagrants, British
Parliamentary Papers, House of Lords., Vol. XVI, 1833, or the Royal
Commission on the Conditions of the Poorer Classes in Ireland, British
Parliamentary Papers, XXXIV, 1836. I could quote a whole raft of other
government reports from throughout the nineteenth century that make exactly
the same observations and recommendations upon the poor Irish. Indeed many
were removed to Ireland from Britain throughout the period as the Poor Law
decreed relief should be paid by the parish of ones birth, this included
many pregnant women. Resourceful migrants utilised this law to claim free
passage back to Ireland and indeed around the rest of Britain, running away
when their transport reached a place near to their destination. Many Irish
travelled from southern England to Birmingham by "jumping ship" in Stafford
in the 1850s. A number of harvesters it seems deposited their seasonal
earnings with a trusted elected treasurer who paid his passage back to
Ireland while his colleagues presented themselves as destitute to the local
Guardian of the Poor Law for relief. He would then authorise their
transportation back to Ireland. Certainly in nineteenth century Birmingham
the local Poor Law officers and magistrates were doing this and expressing
concerns about fraud. They were even deporting Irish women who were
actually eligible under the Poor Law to relief in Birmingham having lived
their for a number of years. (This was known as the period of "industrial
residence"). The difference in the 1930s of course would be that Ireland
was no longer part of Britain so this would be a de jure as well as a de
facto deportation.

Best wishes

Dr. Alex Peach.

- -----Original Message-----
From: irish-diaspora[at]Bradford.ac.uk [SMTP:irish-diaspora[at]Bradford.ac.uk]
Sent: 12 November 2000 13:35
To: irish-diaspora[at]Bradford.ac.uk
Subject: Ir-D 1933 Report on Irish Poor




We have had this message from

Danny McGowan
danny.mcgowan[at]unisonfree.net

I know that a number of us are following up these lines of enquiry, so that
the query is of general interest.

P.O'S.


Dear Irish Diaspora List

The Edinburgh Evening News ran a story last year which cited a British
government report in 1933, commissioned to consider deporting Irish people
who were on poor relief. The article, by a Susan Dalgety, quotes from
sections of the report, including its 'Crime and Lunacy' passages. Susan
Dalgety mentions that the 'secret government papers' were meant to be
closed
for 100 years but had been released by an open government initiative.

I really need to see these papers but don't know where to find them.
Attempts to locate Susan Dalgetty have come to nothing. Can anyone help me?

Danny McGowan

From: "Ruth-Ann M. Harris"
Subject: Re: addendum to Ir-D Baggage 2

In my previous response, I didn't have the Duffy article at
hand. Here it is: P. J. Duffy, ""Assisted Emigration from the Shirley
Estate, 1843-54," in Clogher Record, vol. X, No. 2, 1992, pp.
7-62. Ruth-Ann Harris


At 01:38 PM 11/9/00 +0000, you wrote:

>From: harrisrd
>Subject: RE: Ir-D Baggage
>
>Charles,
> A citation for the Margaret McCarthy letter [Kingwilliamstown] is
>PRONI,
>T3603. I refer to it in the introduction to "The Search for Missing
>Friends,
>Irish Immigrant Advertisements Placed in the Boston Pilot," Vol. II,
1851-53
>[Ruth-Ann M. Harris and B. Emer O'Keeffe, editors] published by the New
>England Historic Genealogical Society, Boston, 1991, pp.ii-iii. I have the
>full text of the letter if you wish to see it.
> Citation for the Shirley Estate documents appears in Patrick J.
>Duffy,[he
>has an article in the Clogher Record which I'll have to look up]. Mine
>appears in "Reclaiming Gender, Transgressive Identities in Modern Ireland"
>edited by Marilyn Cohen and Nancy J. Curtin [New York, St.Martin's Press,
>1999] as Ruth-Ann M. Harris, "Negotiating Patriarchy: Irish Women and the
>Landlord," pp. 207-226.
> Hope this helps. Ruth-Ann Harris
>
>
> >===== Original Message From irish-diaspora[at]Bradford.ac.uk =====
> >From: "Charles E. Orser"
> >Subject: Re: Ir-D Mementoes 4
> >
> >The question of what evicted tenants took with them has obvious
> >archaeological ramifications. Ruth-Ann, can you help with the citations
for
> >the
> >Shirley Estate, Monaghan, and the Kingwilliamstown Estate? Or any
further
> >information?
> >
> >Charles Orser
> >

From: C McCaffrey
Subject: Re: Ir-D Book Advice

John,
I am with you on Amazon. I am somewhat surprised to see that 'many of our US
colleagues are refusing to use Amazon' because of the 'threat' to local
bookstores. The reality for many people in the US is that local bookstores
are
now the maga stores like Borders or B&N which push certain publishers books.
They can order books but why penalize Amazon? These mega stores are not so
great. I live in a rural area and work in town- many in the US do and
Amazon is
an amazing way of getting books quickly which ordinarily would take weeks to
get
or not get at all! Recently I went into Borders for a copy of Nuala Ni
Dhomnaill's poems. They did not even have her on their computer list of
authors. I went home and immediately pulled her up on Amazon and ordered
the
book I wanted.
Carmel McC.

From: P.Gray[at]soton.ac.uk
Subject: Re: Ir-D 1933 Report on Irish Poor 2

Danny
Enda Delaney has an essay in Don Macraild (ed) The Great Famine and after
(2000)
dealing with British migration policy relating to Ireland in the 1920s-40s.
There is material here on the various attempts (mostly driven by the
Scottish
Protestant Churches) to introduce the repatriation of Irish-born recipients
of
poor relief in GB, and the reasons these failed. I suggest you start there.

Peter Gray
University of Southampton

Quoting irish-diaspora[at]Bradford.ac.uk:

>
> From: "joan hugman"
> Subject: Re: Ir-D 1933 Report on Irish Poor
>
> The PRO is the obvious place to look but perhaps you have already
> tried that ??
> Joan
>
> Subject: Ir-D 1933 Report on Irish Poor
> Date: Sun 12 Nov 2000 13:35:00 +0000
>
>
>
> We have had this message from
>
> Danny McGowan
> danny.mcgowan[at]unisonfree.net
>
> I know that a number of us are following up these lines of enquiry, so
that
> the query is of general interest.
>
> P.O'S.
>
>
> Dear Irish Diaspora List
>
> The Edinburgh Evening News ran a story last year which cited a British
> government report in 1933, commissioned to consider deporting Irish people
> who were on poor relief. The article, by a Susan Dalgety, quotes from
> sections of the report, including its 'Crime and Lunacy' passages.
Susan
> Dalgety mentions that the 'secret government papers' were meant to be
closed
> for 100 years but had been released by an open government initiative.
>
> I really need to see these papers but don't know where to find them.
> Attempts to locate Susan Dalgetty have come to nothing. Can anyone help
me?
>
> Danny McGowan
>
>
> Joan Hugman
> Department of History, Armstrong Building,
> University of Newcastle NE1 7RU Tel 0191 222 6701
>

From: "Matt O'Brien"
Subject: Re: Ir-D 1933 Report on Irish Poor 4

My dissertation research on interwar migration between Ireland and Britain
found a series of state inquiries during the late 1920s and 1930s, held at
the request of restrictionists from Clydeside and Merseyside. The
Interdepartmental Committee on Migration to Great Britain from the Irish
Free State conducted the most comprehensive study, which was published in
1937. It can be found in the Ministry of Labour files at the PRO.
Circulation of the report was deliberately limited, however, since the
findings debunked the notion of grossly disproportionate rates of social
service use by Irish-born men and women.
Matt O'Brien
University of Wisconsin-Madison


- -----Original Message-----
From: irish-diaspora[at]Bradford.ac.uk
To: irish-diaspora[at]Bradford.ac.uk
Date: Tuesday, November 14, 2000 4:24 PM
Subject: Ir-D 1933 Report on Irish Poor 4


>
>
>
>
>From: P.Gray[at]soton.ac.uk
>Subject: Re: Ir-D 1933 Report on Irish Poor 2
>
>Danny
>Enda Delaney has an essay in Don Macraild (ed) The Great Famine and after
>(2000)
>dealing with British migration policy relating to Ireland in the 1920s-40s.
>There is material here on the various attempts (mostly driven by the
>Scottish
>Protestant Churches) to introduce the repatriation of Irish-born recipients
>of
>poor relief in GB, and the reasons these failed. I suggest you start there.
>
>Peter Gray
>University of Southampton
>
>Quoting irish-diaspora[at]Bradford.ac.uk:
>
>>
>> From: "joan hugman"
>> Subject: Re: Ir-D 1933 Report on Irish Poor
>>
>> The PRO is the obvious place to look but perhaps you have already
>> tried that ??
>> Joan
>>
>> Subject: Ir-D 1933 Report on Irish Poor
>> Date: Sun 12 Nov 2000 13:35:00 +0000
>>
>>
>>
>> We have had this message from
>>
>> Danny McGowan
>> danny.mcgowan[at]unisonfree.net
>>
>> I know that a number of us are following up these lines of enquiry, so
>that
>> the query is of general interest.
>>
>> P.O'S.
>>
>>
>> Dear Irish Diaspora List
>>
>> The Edinburgh Evening News ran a story last year which cited a British
>> government report in 1933, commissioned to consider deporting Irish
people
>> who were on poor relief. The article, by a Susan Dalgety, quotes from
>> sections of the report, including its 'Crime and Lunacy' passages.
>Susan
>> Dalgety mentions that the 'secret government papers' were meant to be
>closed
>> for 100 years but had been released by an open government initiative.
>>
>> I really need to see these papers but don't know where to find them.
>> Attempts to locate Susan Dalgetty have come to nothing. Can anyone help
>me?
>>
>> Danny McGowan
>>
>>
>> Joan Hugman
>> Department of History, Armstrong Building,
>> University of Newcastle NE1 7RU Tel 0191 222 6701
>>
>

From: Cymru66[at]aol.com
Subject: Re: Ir-D 1933 Report on Irish Poor 3

Dear Paddy,
I used the Reports of the Poor Law Commissions in the 19th Century fairly
extensively in my study of the Irish immigrants in Cardiff.
I suggest that your original correspondent follows Alex Peach's advice (
congratulations on the Doctorate, Alex) and looks-up the references he
quoted. I have problems with the date of the article quoted but that's
another matter.
Best,
John

The following item from
IRISH NEWS ROUND-UP
http://irlnet.com/rmlist/
has been brought to our attention...

>
> >>>>>> History: Fenian commemoration in Birmingham
>
>
> The fact that Fenian leaders were active in Birmingham is well
> known, not least from the pages of John Denvir's "The Irish in
> Britain". Here, the presence of Colonel Ricard Burke, of Daniel
> Darragh, and of Michael Davitt were reported.
>
> The extent of sympathy with the aspirations of the Fenians has
> not been reported, so that while we have records of the
> demonstrations in London and Manchester in November 1867 to
> honour the Manchester Martyrs, there are no reports of the
> demonstration in Birmingham.
>
> In Birmingham, the movement for the remission of the death
> sentences on William Allen, Michael Larkin, Michael O'Brien and
> Edward Condon held a mass meeting behind the Town Hall, in the
> city centre, on Wednesday 23 November. There was a violent
> response from an English Tory mob, which that night and the next
> tried to attack Irish areas and Catholic churches. The
> contemporary Tory paper, the Gazette, describes these attackers
> being driven off by Irish men and women.
>
> Despite these attacks, which resulted in ten people being taken
> to the General Hospital, eight of them with head wounds, a
> service of remembrance was held for William Allen, Michael Larkin
> and Michael O'Brien on the day after their execution, in St
> Joseph's Churchyard, Nechells.
>
> As reported in Birmingham's Liberal newspaper (The Birmingham
> Daily Post, 25 November 1867), 2,500 Irish people assembled on
> the slopes of St Joseph's at 3 o'clock on Sunday 24 November
> 1867. The report says: "There were many women present, and the
> greater part, both men and women, wore green ribbons on their
> hats, a few had green rosettes on their coats." No priest
> officiated; a young man led the people in a prayer for the dead.
> As well as the Irish mourners, a huge crowd of respectful
> spectators had gathered.
>
> The police had decreed that no procession would be permitted and
> before the service they had prevented any processions from the
> town centre. After the service, the police were unable to prevent
> an organised procession of about 2,000 people marching from St
> Joseph's back to the Old Square in the town. Here, however, the
> march was dispersed by more than a hundred police.
>
> This demonstration of respect for the Manchester Martyrs seems to
> have gone largely unreported. Yet it is remarkable because it
> numbered about a quarter of Birmingham's Irish-born population
> and because of the vulnerability of this Irish population, about
> 9,000 Irish-born people in a town of more than 300,000. It is all
> the more remarkable because it took place only six months after
> the vicious anti-Irish riots of June 1867.
>
> The June rioters took their lead from William Murphy, an employee
> of the Protestant Electoral Union, and his fellow orators, who
> delivered a mixture of anti-Catholic and anti-Irish invective to
> large crowds, twice a day for five weeks. Murphy warned that
> anyone who interfered with the lectures would be driven "to
> Paddy's land, or to Dixie land".
>
> On the second day of Murphy's lectures, an English mob, described
> by "respectable" contemporary observers as being made up of the
> police, special constables and "roughs", wrecked many Irish homes
> and assaulted Irish people. More than 100 Irish people were
> arrested, men and women, and charged with conspiracy. Claims for
> damages for the property destroyed were made, but only three were
> met, partially. Several people were badly injured by police
> sabres, and one woman died from injuries received in the crush.
>
> A month later, on 16 July, Michael McNally, who was said to be a
> leader of the Irish resistance to Murphy, was shot and killed by
> Morris Roberts, one of Murphy's supporters. Morris Roberts was
> found by a jury of his English peers to have committed
> "justifiable homicide" in shooting the unarmed Michael McNally in
> the chest. The young man, Michael McNally, arrested on the first
> day of Murphy's lectures, and murdered in the aftermath of the
> June riots, is, I think, buried in an unmarked grave in Witton
> cemetery.
>
> Therefore, Birmingham's commemoration of the Manchester Martyrs
> on Sunday, 25 November 1867, the day after their execution,
> merits a place alongside those of London and Manchester.
>
> BY PATSY DAVIS
> BIRMINGHAM
>
>

From: Alexander Peach
Subject: RE: Ir-D Fenian Commemoration in Birmingham

All of this - below - is indeed true and there is much more to tell. You
will have to wait for my book however for the full story.

Best wishes,

Dr. Alex Peach.

- -----Original Message-----
From: irish-diaspora[at]Bradford.ac.uk [SMTP:irish-diaspora[at]Bradford.ac.uk]
Sent: 15 November 2000 09:01
To: irish-diaspora[at]Bradford.ac.uk
Subject: Ir-D Fenian Commemoration in Birmingham



The following item from
IRISH NEWS ROUND-UP
http://irlnet.com/rmlist/
has been brought to our attention...

>
> >>>>>> History: Fenian commemoration in Birmingham
>
>
> The fact that Fenian leaders were active in Birmingham is well
> known, not least from the pages of John Denvir's "The Irish in
> Britain". Here, the presence of Colonel Ricard Burke, of Daniel
> Darragh, and of Michael Davitt were reported.
>
> The extent of sympathy with the aspirations of the Fenians has
> not been reported, so that while we have records of the
> demonstrations in London and Manchester in November 1867 to
> honour the Manchester Martyrs, there are no reports of the
> demonstration in Birmingham.
>
> In Birmingham, the movement for the remission of the death
> sentences on William Allen, Michael Larkin, Michael O'Brien and
> Edward Condon held a mass meeting behind the Town Hall, in the
> city centre, on Wednesday 23 November. There was a violent
> response from an English Tory mob, which that night and the next
> tried to attack Irish areas and Catholic churches. The
> contemporary Tory paper, the Gazette, describes these attackers
> being driven off by Irish men and women.
>
> Despite these attacks, which resulted in ten people being taken
> to the General Hospital, eight of them with head wounds, a
> service of remembrance was held for William Allen, Michael Larkin
> and Michael O'Brien on the day after their execution, in St
> Joseph's Churchyard, Nechells.
>
> As reported in Birmingham's Liberal newspaper (The Birmingham
> Daily Post, 25 November 1867), 2,500 Irish people assembled on
> the slopes of St Joseph's at 3 o'clock on Sunday 24 November
> 1867. The report says: "There were many women present, and the
> greater part, both men and women, wore green ribbons on their
> hats, a few had green rosettes on their coats." No priest
> officiated; a young man led the people in a prayer for the dead.
> As well as the Irish mourners, a huge crowd of respectful
> spectators had gathered.
>
> The police had decreed that no procession would be permitted and
> before the service they had prevented any processions from the
> town centre. After the service, the police were unable to prevent
> an organised procession of about 2,000 people marching from St
> Joseph's back to the Old Square in the town. Here, however, the
> march was dispersed by more than a hundred police.
>
> This demonstration of respect for the Manchester Martyrs seems to
> have gone largely unreported. Yet it is remarkable because it
> numbered about a quarter of Birmingham's Irish-born population
> and because of the vulnerability of this Irish population, about
> 9,000 Irish-born people in a town of more than 300,000. It is all
> the more remarkable because it took place only six months after
> the vicious anti-Irish riots of June 1867.
>
> The June rioters took their lead from William Murphy, an employee
> of the Protestant Electoral Union, and his fellow orators, who
> delivered a mixture of anti-Catholic and anti-Irish invective to
> large crowds, twice a day for five weeks. Murphy warned that
> anyone who interfered with the lectures would be driven "to
> Paddy's land, or to Dixie land".
>
> On the second day of Murphy's lectures, an English mob, described
> by "respectable" contemporary observers as being made up of the
> police, special constables and "roughs", wrecked many Irish homes
> and assaulted Irish people. More than 100 Irish people were
> arrested, men and women, and charged with conspiracy. Claims for
> damages for the property destroyed were made, but only three were
> met, partially. Several people were badly injured by police
> sabres, and one woman died from injuries received in the crush.
>
> A month later, on 16 July, Michael McNally, who was said to be a
> leader of the Irish resistance to Murphy, was shot and killed by
> Morris Roberts, one of Murphy's supporters. Morris Roberts was
> found by a jury of his English peers to have committed
> "justifiable homicide" in shooting the unarmed Michael McNally in
> the chest. The young man, Michael McNally, arrested on the first
> day of Murphy's lectures, and murdered in the aftermath of the
> June riots, is, I think, buried in an unmarked grave in Witton
> cemetery.
>
> Therefore, Birmingham's commemoration of the Manchester Martyrs
> on Sunday, 25 November 1867, the day after their execution,
> merits a place alongside those of London and Manchester.
>
> BY PATSY DAVIS
> BIRMINGHAM
>
>

A warm welcome to a new book from Ir-D member...

Bronwen Walter

Outsiders Inside
whiteness, place and Irish women

Routledge
London and New York 2001
ISBN paperback 0 415 12398 4
hardback 0 415 12397 6

[That year of publication is correct - late in the year publishers will
often give the next year as the year of publication...]

The Introduction begins by looking briefly at the research and the
literature on Irish women migrants. There is a tendency for direct
experiences to be 'prioritised over analysis.' 'However a breakthrough was
marked by the publication of an edited volume entitled Irish Women and Irish
Migration... in Patrick O'Sullivan's series The Irish World Wide...' 'What
is still missing is a critical synthesis of ideas about Irish women in the
diaspora...'

And this critical synthesis is Bronwen Walter's aim, with, it will be seen,
substantial sections on Irish women in the USA and in Britain. I have
pasted in, below, the full Contents of the book, for Ir-D members will want
an idea of the book's range and approach.

A full review of the book will appear in due course.

P.O'S.

Contents

List of plates
List of figures

Acknowledgents

Introduction

1. Diaspora: key concepts and contexts
A diaspora framework: spatial and social concepts
Irish women's migration: empirical subjects
Representations of women in Ireland
Racialisation: otherness and sameness
Shared diaspora space

2. Outside the Pale: Irish women in the United States of America
Displacement: women's routes
Placement
Representations of Irish women
Conclusions

3. Inside the Pale: constructions of Irish women's place in Britain
Gendered constructions of the Irish in Britain as 'other'
Gendered constructions of the Irish as 'the same '
Conclusions

4. Material lives in Britain: geographical contexts of settlement and work
Geographical patterns of settlement in Britain
Textile Workers in Scotland and North West England
Domestic service workers in South East England
Irish women in post-war Britain: workplaces
Conclusions

5. Everyday encounters: lived realities of racialisation in post-war Britain
Voices and language
Contexts of anti-Irish hostility
Strategies of avoidance
Second-generation identities
Contexts of work: Irish nurses
Diasporic intersections
Conclusions

6. Meanings of home: identities and belonging
Identities of displacement: Ireland as 'home'
Identities of placement: homes outside Ireland
Conclusions

7. Doubled relationships of displacement and placement: Irish women in
Bolton
Women's stories
Rural women from the West of Ireand: Mary, Eileen, Bridie, Kathleen and Nora
Two women from the Dublin area: Margaret and Bernadette
Women from Northern Ireland: Deirdre, Teresa and Anne
Commentary: difference and belonging

Conclusion
Bibliography
Index

From: Hilary Robinson
Subject: Re: Ir-D Book Advice

Paddy, I know this bookshop thing is tangental to the list, but it is
something which affects all humanities scholars... use your judgement about
forwarding this. I'm certainly not pro the mega-stores either! and was also
surprized about the anti-amazon movement apparent in NY last spring. This
was at a book launch held during the College Art Association annual
conference, which had about 4000 delegates. There were I guess about 300
people at the launch, and the issue came up during the speeches, about
ordering the book for both personal and teaching use. The argument was that
the damage caused by the chains is being completed by amazon. Certainly
many small-town bookshops have closed, and academic cities like edinburgh
have had their book-shop profile utterly changed in the last decade. Anyone
remember First of May and Lavender Menace in Edinburgh - places where you
could find all sorts of wonderful things - not only books but journals too
- - particularly politics, history, cultural etc. Am I being too nostalgic?
or just idealistic?! Edinburgh had _3_ waterstone's last time I was there
(excessive by anyone's reckoning, surely), and James Thin still bravely in
there. Here in Belfast the two Waterstone's are closest to me, but I would
order books now through the Bookshop at Queens.

best,

hilary

>From: C McCaffrey
>Subject: Re: Ir-D Book Advice
>
>John,
>I am with you on Amazon. I am somewhat surprised to see that 'many of our
US
>colleagues are refusing to use Amazon' because of the 'threat' to local
>bookstores. The reality for many people in the US is that local bookstores
>are
>now the maga stores like Borders or B&N which push certain publishers
books.
>They can order books but why penalize Amazon? These mega stores are not so
>great. I live in a rural area and work in town- many in the US do and
>Amazon is
>an amazing way of getting books quickly which ordinarily would take weeks
to
>get
>or not get at all! Recently I went into Borders for a copy of Nuala Ni
>Dhomnaill's poems. They did not even have her on their computer list of
>authors. I went home and immediately pulled her up on Amazon and ordered
>the
>book I wanted.
>Carmel McC.


_______________________________

Dr. Hilary Robinson
School of Art and Design
University of Ulster at Belfast
York Street
Belfast BT15 1ED
Northern Ireland
UK


direct phone/fax: (+44) (0) 28 9026.7291)

From Email Patrick O'Sullivan

On a train of thought...

My recent bed time reading (Calm down, calm down - you CAN go to sleep...)
turns out to have quite a bit of Irish Diaspora content...

The book is

Michael Kreyling
Author and Agent: Eudora Welty and Diarmuid Russell
Bellew, London, 1992 - first published by Farrar, Straus in New York.

Bought for 99 pence in a secondhand bookshop.

The book is based on the letters which flowed between Welty and Russell.
Russell was Welty's New York based agent for most of her career, negotiating
the placing of her short stories with the right journals, and her
collections and novels with the right publishers. He seems to have been
extraordinarily loyal and supportive - and she often mentioned him in
interviews.

Russell was the son of AE, George Russell, the Irish poet, mystic and social
reformer, whose place in the history of the Irish 'literary renaissance'
will be familiar. With Michael Kreyling's guidance we can recognise the
father's influence on the son's advice to Welty - as in (p. 75), 'as I am
always quoting, "Let the joy be in doing and not in the end"...'

[Not advice that would make great sense to me, since the only thing that
keeps me going through the agony and the dark night of the soul is the
knowledge that at the end of the task a separate thing has been created...
A bit like giving birth. So I'm told...]

Kreyling links Diarmuid Russell's distrust of theatre folk with his father's
disagreements with Yeats and O'Casey (p. 149). (And, of course, AE was
eventually to flee Ireland, 'a nation run by louts', to settle in England.)

The play based on Welty's 'The Ponder Heart' opened at the Music Box, New
York, in February 1956. Luckily the play that WOULD have opened in that
theatre, that month, had temporarily folded 'out of town' - a little thing
called 'Waiting for Godot'...

Kreyling is a little less certain in other areas - Elizabeth Bowen is
sometimes an English and sometimes an Irish writer. Though, I guess, that
may simply be a reflection of the facts. I am not a great Welty fan - but
apparently there is an 'Irish' short story, 'The Bride of Innisfallen',
first drafted in Bowen's home in Cork. Any good?

Patrick O'Sullivan

- --
Patrick O'Sullivan
Head of the Irish Diaspora Research Unit

Email Patrick O'Sullivan
Email Patrick O'Sullivan

Irish-Diaspora list
Irish Diaspora Studies http://www.brad.ac.uk/acad/diaspora/

Personal Fax National 0870 284 1580
Fax International +44 870 284 1580

Irish Diaspora Research Unit
Department of Interdisciplinary Human Studies
University of Bradford
Bradford BD7 1DP
Yorkshire
England

From Email Patrick O'Sullivan

The discussion of Amazon VS the conglomerates VS the little local book shop
reminds me of a suggestion that has been floated by some Ir-D members, under
the How we might help each other banner...

The suggestion is that we log on to sites like Amazon, and there post
favourable or ecstatic reviews of colleague's books. This has the effect of
making our books more visible, and making Irish Diaspora Studies more
visible.

We all know the pain and misery involved in producing a book, or an article,
or even a letter to granma. Sometimes I have been asked to review books
that I thought were really bad efforts - and since I couldn't think of
anything kind to say I have had to return the books to the Reviews Editors.
So, I think the suggestion is that we NOT wash dirty linen in public - as
the saying is. Briefly praise, put in context, mention debates...

It's a thought...

By the way, Hilary is right - the general discussion of Amazon etc. is
really not relevant to the Irish-Diaspora list...

P.O'S.


- --
Patrick O'Sullivan
Head of the Irish Diaspora Research Unit

Email Patrick O'Sullivan
Email Patrick O'Sullivan

Irish-Diaspora list
Irish Diaspora Studies http://www.brad.ac.uk/acad/diaspora/

Personal Fax National 0870 284 1580
Fax International +44 870 284 1580

Irish Diaspora Research Unit
Department of Interdisciplinary Human Studies
University of Bradford
Bradford BD7 1DP
Yorkshire
England

From Email Patrick O'Sullivan

Many Irish-Diaspora list members will be interested in The Irish in Britain:
An Annotated Bibliography on Health and Related Issues, published by
Federation of Irish Societies, London.

As will members of the Irish voluntary agencies throughout the world - for
the same patterns of problems are turning up throughout the Diaspora, as are
the same difficulties of negotiating our way through a fragmentary and often
stereotyped and prejudiced research literature.

I have pasted in below contact information and the list of contents, to show
the range of material and subjects covered in a 60 page booklet. The
compilers have concentrated on published material, which is most probably
the right approach. They give a helpful summary of each source, outlining
the research methodology and the findings. Perhaps we might have wished
them to be a bit more analytical and critical - but that is not the task
they set themselves. Perhaps that is our task...

P.O'S.


The Irish in Britain
An Annotated Bibliography on Health and Related Issues

Compiled by:
Maire Gaffney, Mary Tilki, Brian Lovett, Karen Scanlon, Sean Hutton, Greg
Cahill, Peter Aspinall and David Kelleher .

Published by the Federation of Irish Societies, London, 2000, Price £5

ISBN 0 9533719 3 X

Federation of Irish Societies
The London Irish Centre
50-52 Camden Square
London NW1 9XB

Fax 020 7916 2753

1.Alcohol
2.Cancer
3.Community Surveys and Profiles
4.Criminal Justice
5.Emigration
6.Employment
7.Ethnicity and Diversity in Health
8.Health in Ireland
9.Housing
10.Identity
11.Mental Health
12.Older People
13.Racism
14.Smoking
15.Suicide
16.Travellers
17.Women

Index of authors

- --
Patrick O'Sullivan
Head of the Irish Diaspora Research Unit

Email Patrick O'Sullivan
Email Patrick O'Sullivan

Irish-Diaspora list
Irish Diaspora Studies http://www.brad.ac.uk/acad/diaspora/

Personal Fax National 0870 284 1580
Fax International +44 870 284 1580

Irish Diaspora Research Unit
Department of Interdisciplinary Human Studies
University of Bradford
Bradford BD7 1DP
Yorkshire
England

From Email Patrick O'Sullivan

We note the welcome launch of

Radharc
Chronicles of the Glucksman Ireland House, New York University

with Volume 1, November 2000

containing

J.J. Lee

'Millenial Reflections on Irish-American History'

the Ernie O'Malley Lecture Series No. 1.

This is, in effect, a little booklet, in which a fine forensic mind
summarises and re-directs the historiography of Irish-America...

The Glucksman Ireland House Web site is at

www.nyu.edu/pages/irelandhouse

Email irelandhouse[at]nyu.edu

Volume 2 is scheduled for November 2001, and will include the second Ernie
O'Malley lecture, Dale T. Knobel, 'Celtic Exodus: The Famine Irish, Ethnic
Stereotypes, and the Cultivation of American Racial Nationalism', with a
response by Kevin Kenny.

I have been sent the pricing structure for Radharc - $8.00 for USA
individuals, $24 for USA Institutions, $30 for Institutions in Europe and
Canada. This means that it will be practically impossible to persuade any
institution on this side of the Atlantic to subscribe. Also, Irish Studies
and Irish Diaspora Studies centres outside Europe and Canada should not be
offended - I am thinking of little places like Australia, South Africa, New
Zealand, Argentina, Brazil... An acknowledgement of the existence of Europe
and Canada is a great leap forward, and we should not expect or attempt to
travel too far on the first day...

P.O'S.

- --
Patrick O'Sullivan
Head of the Irish Diaspora Research Unit

Email Patrick O'Sullivan
Email Patrick O'Sullivan

Irish-Diaspora list
Irish Diaspora Studies http://www.brad.ac.uk/acad/diaspora/

Personal Fax National 0870 284 1580
Fax International +44 870 284 1580

Irish Diaspora Research Unit
Department of Interdisciplinary Human Studies
University of Bradford
Bradford BD7 1DP
Yorkshire
England