Sender: The Irish Diaspora Studies List
From: Patrick O'Sullivan
Subject: The Israeli-Irish troubles
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

From: Joe Bradley [mailto:j.m.bradley[at]stir.ac.uk]=20
Sent: 08 September 2006 12:22

I thought this might be of interest...

From the Jerusalem Post online...
=A0
Sep. 6, 2006 22:28=A0|=A0Updated Sep. 7, 2006 20:38
The Israeli-Irish troubles
By MANFRED GERSTENFELD

'If one were to throw a sack of flour over the Irish parliament, it is
unlikely that anybody pro-Israeli would get white," says Rory Miller. =
"Among
the 120 members of the D il - the Irish parliament's lower house - and =
the
100 members of the Senate, not one name springs to mind as a regular
defender of Israel. There are either those who do not care or
pro-Palestinians."=20
According to Dr. Miller, senior lecturer in Mediterranean Studies at =
King's
College, London, Irish political sympathies have always been firmly with =
the
Palestinians.=20
In February 1980, Ireland became the first EEC (European Economic =
Community)
member to call publicly for the inclusion of the PLO in the political
process at a time when Yasser Arafat's group not only refused to =
recognize
Israel's right to exist, but was engaged in a relentless campaign of =
terror
against Israeli and Jewish targets across the globe.=20
More surprisingly, he says, throughout the 1980s successive Irish
governments were prepared to overlook PLO terrorism that directly =
attacked
Irish troops serving in Lebanon with the UN.=20
"The Irish see themselves as anticolonial victims of partition and
ultimately victors over the British... In Mahmoud Abbas, Arafat and =
Hamas,
they see those who struggle against a colonial ruler. The Irish cannot =
shake
off the belief that Israel is a colonial oppressor," says Miller.=20
But, he continues, "Analytically speaking, it is easy to show that they =
have
much more in common with Israel than with the Palestinians."=20
Born in Dublin in 1971, Miller holds a BA in history from Trinity =
College,
Dublin, an MA in war studies, and a PhD in Mediterranean studies from =
King's
College, where his lectures focus on US and EU involvement in the Middle
East. He has published two books: Divided against Zion: Anti-Zionist
Opposition to a Jewish State in Palestine, 1945-48 and more recently =
Ireland
and the Palestine Question, 1948-2004.=20
Speaking in a lengthy telephone interview, Miller says Ireland's =
positions
during the recent fighting in Lebanon were, as ever, in line with those =
of
much of the rest of the European Union, including criticism of Israel =
for
perceived excessive use of force, and demands that Hizbullah return the
kidnapped soldiers and stop the rocket-fire on Israel.=20
He stresses that, in contrast to some European countries, there are no =
Irish
politicians who make a career out of attacking Israel.=20
But at the root of his overview of Irish-Israel relations - and this
interview covers matters such as trade ties and the Irish Muslim =
community
as well as politics and diplomacy - is Miller's sense that a natural
affinity should long since have grown up between two countries that =
share so
many significant aspects yet so often find themselves at odds.=20
The Irish Jewish community=20
Although in recent decades the Jews were remarkably well represented in =
the
Irish parliament, Jews were always insignificant in number in Ireland. =
Even
at its most vibrant in 1949, the Jewish community only numbered =
4,000-5,000.
Today it numbers around 1,500. There are also about 600 Israelis, with =
the
number of Jews who are moving to Ireland for work, particularly to =
Dublin,
increasing. Many are active in the community; a few, however, are =
leaders in
anti-Israeli activities, says Miller. They were not involved in the =
politics
of the Northern Ireland crisis between Catholics and Protestants, or =
"the
Troubles" as it came to be known.=20
"When Ireland became a republic upon leaving the British Commonwealth in
1949, it was written in the Irish constitution that Judaism was a state
religion. It thus had the same rights as Catholicism and Protestantism,"
says Miller.

Sender: The Irish Diaspora Studies List
From: Patrick O'Sullivan
Subject: As though everything I had ever loved and lost...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

From: Thomas J. Archdeacon [mailto:tjarchde[at]wisc.edu]=20
Sent: 08 September 2006 18:13
Subject: RE: [IR-D] As though everything I had ever loved and lost...

I don't know if it's common in literature, but on my first flight to =
Europe
(to London), I experienced a similar wave of emotion when morning broke =
and
I realized that I was looking out the window at Ireland.

Tom

-----Original Message-----
Subject: [IR-D] As though everything I had ever loved and lost...

From: Brian Lambkin [mailto:Brian.Lambkin[at]magni.org.uk]=20
Sent: 08 September 2006 09:28

The Irish Times journalist Kate Holmquist, who grew up in =
Baltimore,=A0has an
interesting piece in last Saturday's Irish Times magazine (September 2)
about the writing of her first novel. It contains the following about =
her
first encounter with Ireland, when she was aged about 18:
=A0
'...Here=92s a strange story: never in my childhood did I have a =
connection to
Ireland. Yet on my first flight to Europe, heading for Paris, I had one =
of
those moments whose significance becomes clear only in later life. We =
flew
over Shannon, and the pilot pointed out the Cliffs of Moher. I looked =
down
from the tiny window and was overcome by emotion. It was as though
everything I had ever loved and lost was somewhere down on that island, =
and
as if I was a grieving angel looking down on a past life, beginning, =
middle
and end.'
=A0
Can anyone please=A0say whether or not this is a common topos in =
literature?
=A0
Brian Lambkin
=09

Sender: The Irish Diaspora Studies List
From: Patrick O'Sullivan
Subject: As though everything I had ever loved and lost...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

From: Rogers, James [mailto:JROGERS[at]stthomas.edu]=20
Sent: 08 September 2006 19:53
Subject: RE: [IR-D] As though everything I had ever loved and lost...

Brian, I am not entirely sure which part of Holmquist's remarks you are
asking about--but if you mean the idea that Ireland is somehow uniquely
comprehensive of a larger human experience of loss, that sounds familiar
enough; I seem to recall something much along those lines in Rebecca
Solnit's "The Book of Migrations: Some Passages in Ireland" (1997).=20

I'm going to have dig out that article -- sounds intersting

Jim Rogers =20

-----Original Message-----
From: Patrick O'Sullivan [mailto:P.OSullivan[at]bradford.ac.uk]=20
Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 5:21 AM
To: IR-D[at]JISCMAIL.AC.UK
Subject: [IR-D] As though everything I had ever loved and lost...

From: Brian Lambkin [mailto:Brian.Lambkin[at]magni.org.uk]=20
Sent: 08 September 2006 09:28

The Irish Times journalist Kate Holmquist, who grew up in =
Baltimore,=A0has an
interesting piece in last Saturday's Irish Times magazine (September 2)
about the writing of her first novel. It contains the following about =
her
first encounter with Ireland, when she was aged about 18:
=A0
'...Here's a strange story: never in my childhood did I have a =
connection to
Ireland. Yet on my first flight to Europe, heading for Paris, I had one =
of
those moments whose significance becomes clear only in later life. We =
flew
over Shannon, and the pilot pointed out the Cliffs of Moher. I looked =
down
from the tiny window and was overcome by emotion. It was as though
everything I had ever loved and lost was somewhere down on that island, =
and
as if I was a grieving angel looking down on a past life, beginning, =
middle
and end.'
=A0
Can anyone please=A0say whether or not this is a common topos in =
literature?
=A0
Brian Lambkin
=09

Sender: The Irish Diaspora Studies List
From: "William Mulligan Jr."
Subject: Call for Papers: 2007 Conference of the Consortium on the
Revolutionary Era
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

This may be of interest to the list. The United Irishmen would seem to =
be
well within the scope of this conference. =20

Call for Papers: 2007 Conference of the Consortium on the Revolutionary =
Era
(CRE)

The Consortium on the Revolutionary Era issues its third and final call =
for
papers for its 2007 Conference, scheduled for the weekend of March 1-3. =
With
an expanded scope, the CRE is now a venue for both traditional =
revolutionary
history and comparative efforts. Sessions will focus both on Europe and
other places, especially those throughout the Atlantic world, from
1750-1850.

The 2007 conference will be held at the Westin Arlington Gateway Hotel =
in
Arlington, Virginia, close in to Washington, D.C., and near the Metro. =
The
hotel is also conveniently located near many area shops and restaurants. =
Our
three plenary speakers for the conference include Philip Morgan of Johns
Hopkins, Sarah Maza of Northwestern, and Charles Tilly of Columbia.

The deadline for proposals is October 15, 2006. The program committee
prefers complete sessions (three papers, a chair, and commentator) but =
will
also accept proposals for incomplete sessions and individual papers. =
Please
include name of presenter, title of paper, and brief abstract (no more =
than
one page, single-spaced) for each paper; and brief CVs (no more than 2
pages) for each participant, as part of your proposal. Both traditional
presentations of new research and roundtable discussions are welcome.
Proposals from doctoral students are encouraged.

For more information on the Consortium, see our website,
http://revolutionaryera.org/.=20

Please send proposals to=20
Jennifer Lansbury,
Department of History and Art History,=20
George Mason University, MSN 3G1,
4400 University Blvd.,=20
Fairfax, Virginia, 22030.=20

Electronic proposals should also be sent to Jenny at jlansbur[at]gmu.edu.=20

If you have any questions, please feel free to contact her at the above
email, or call at 703-978-5143.



William H. Mulligan, Jr., Ph.D.
Professor of History
Murray State University
Murray KY 42071-3341 USA=20
=20
=20

Sender: The Irish Diaspora Studies List
From: "Murray, Edmundo"
Subject: Rodolfo Walsh, con las armas del lenguaje
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I thought this would be of interest to IR-D list members.

Muleiro, Vicente, "Rodolfo Walsh, con las armas del lenguaje" in Clarin =
newspaper (Buenos Aires), 9 September 2006.

This article (in Spanish) is about a newly published book by Rodolfo =
Walsh (1927-1977), short-story writer, journalist, and intelligence =
officer of Montoneros, the most important guerrilla organisation in =
1970s Argentina:
http://www.clarin.com/suplementos/cultura/2006/09/09/u-01267840.htm

Some of the short stories ("Irlandeses detr=E1s de un gato", "Los =
oficios terrestres", and "Un oscuro d=EDa de justicia") are related to =
the author's days in a school for Irish orphans and others without =
means, supported by the wealthy Irish women of the St. Joseph Ladies =
Society (http://www.assj.org.ar/).

A short bio of Rodolfo Walsh is at =
http://www.irlandeses.org/dilab_walshr.htm

Edmundo Murray

Sender: The Irish Diaspora Studies List
From: Patrick O'Sullivan
Subject: As though everything I had ever loved and lost...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

From: Brian Lambkin [mailto:Brian.Lambkin[at]magni.org.uk]
Sent: 11 September 2006 14:13
Subject: RE: [IR-D] As though everything I had ever loved and lost...

Thanks to Tom and Jim for their comments.
What struck me in particular was the idea that the 'first sighting' of a
place (in this case Ireland),whether from land, sea, or air (as in this
case), could trigger an overwhelming emotional response. This is
understandable in the case of a returned emigrant, or descendant of an
emigrant, but Holmquist's case seems remarkable because she had no previous
connection with Ireland.
Brian

-----Original Message-----
From: Rogers, James [mailto:JROGERS[at]stthomas.edu]
Sent: 08 September 2006 19:53
Subject: RE: [IR-D] As though everything I had ever loved and lost...

Brian, I am not entirely sure which part of Holmquist's remarks you are
asking about--but if you mean the idea that Ireland is somehow uniquely
comprehensive of a larger human experience of loss, that sounds familiar
enough; I seem to recall something much along those lines in Rebecca
Solnit's "The Book of Migrations: Some Passages in Ireland" (1997).

I'm going to have dig out that article -- sounds intersting

Jim Rogers

Sender: The Irish Diaspora Studies List
From: "Rogers, James"
Subject: Re: As though everything I had ever loved and lost...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain

Brian, Thanks -- that clarifies things.

Nothing leaps to mind right now as a case of unanticipated "love at first
sight" with the Irish landscape, etc, except that I know I have heard loads
and loads of comparable anecdotal accounts. I'd love to hear of other
memoirs, travel accounts, etc, that include such moments

I suspect-- and this is walking into a speculative stratosphere, I realize--
that it has something to do with the persons who get this surge of
connection having already imaginatively constructed Ireland as a spiritual
place, or maybe more precisely as a place where some kind of spiritual
transformation is possible for them. Whether it's the orthodoxies of Bishop
Spalding's "Religious Mission of the Irish People" (1880) or the cosmic
surfings of today's New Age Celts, the idea floating around the world that
Ireland has a distinctly spiritual cast seems indestructible.

For the record, I haven't touched a drop tonight. You should hear the kind
of vaporings I can produce along these lines after a couple of glasses of
wine!

Jim Rogers

-----Original Message-----
From: Patrick O'Sullivan [mailto:P.OSullivan[at]bradford.ac.uk]
Sent: Monday, September 11, 2006 8:12 AM
To: IR-D[at]JISCMAIL.AC.UK
Subject: [IR-D] As though everything I had ever loved and lost...

From: Brian Lambkin [mailto:Brian.Lambkin[at]magni.org.uk]
Sent: 11 September 2006 14:13
Subject: RE: [IR-D] As though everything I had ever loved and lost...

Thanks to Tom and Jim for their comments.
What struck me in particular was the idea that the 'first sighting' of a
place (in this case Ireland),whether from land, sea, or air (as in this
case), could trigger an overwhelming emotional response. This is
understandable in the case of a returned emigrant, or descendant of an
emigrant, but Holmquist's case seems remarkable because she had no previous
connection with Ireland.
Brian

-----Original Message-----
From: Rogers, James [mailto:JROGERS[at]stthomas.edu]
Sent: 08 September 2006 19:53
Subject: RE: [IR-D] As though everything I had ever loved and lost...

Brian, I am not entirely sure which part of Holmquist's remarks you are
asking about--but if you mean the idea that Ireland is somehow uniquely
comprehensive of a larger human experience of loss, that sounds familiar
enough; I seem to recall something much along those lines in Rebecca
Solnit's "The Book of Migrations: Some Passages in Ireland" (1997).

I'm going to have dig out that article -- sounds intersting

Jim Rogers

Sender: The Irish Diaspora Studies List
From: Ultan Cowley
Organization: Eircom Net (http://www.eircom.net/)
Subject: Re: As though everything I had ever loved and lost...
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

Isn't it amusing that no one (including Ms. Holmquist)can imagine a personal historic connection because she hasn't any 'Irish' ancestry.

What about the Danish settlements? Maybe Lief Erikson was a rep. for Guiness's?

Ultan Cowley






The Irish Diaspora Studies List wrote:

<
< From: Brian Lambkin [mailto:Brian.Lambkin[at]magni.org.uk]
< Sent: 11 September 2006 14:13
< Subject: RE: [IR-D] As though everything I had ever loved and lost...
<
< Thanks to Tom and Jim for their comments.
< What struck me in particular was the idea that the 'first sighting' of a
< place (in this case Ireland),whether from land, sea, or air (as in this
< case), could trigger an overwhelming emotional response. This is
< understandable in the case of a returned emigrant, or descendant of an
< emigrant, but Holmquist's case seems remarkable because she had no previous
< connection with Ireland.
< Brian
<
< -----Original Message-----
< From: Rogers, James [mailto:JROGERS[at]stthomas.edu]
< Sent: 08 September 2006 19:53
< Subject: RE: [IR-D] As though everything I had ever loved and lost...
<
< Brian, I am not entirely sure which part of Holmquist's remarks you are
< asking about--but if you mean the idea that Ireland is somehow uniquely
< comprehensive of a larger human experience of loss, that sounds familiar
< enough; I seem to recall something much along those lines in Rebecca
< Solnit's "The Book of Migrations: Some Passages in Ireland" (1997).
<
< I'm going to have dig out that article -- sounds intersting
<
< Jim Rogers
<



-----------------------------------------------------------------
Find the home of your dreams with eircom net property
Sign up for email alerts now http://www.eircom.net/propertyalerts

Sender: The Irish Diaspora Studies List
From: "D.C. Rose"
Subject: Re: As though everything I had ever loved and lost...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

We must not undervalue the power of the literary imagination. I remind =
you of Nabokov's reply when asked if he knew Dublin: 'As well as anyone =
can ... who has never been there'. One does not have to be an Italian =
to embrace Venice or Greek to be moved at the first sight of the =
Acropolis. Has any one read Heinrich Boll's Irischer Tagebuch lately? =
I seem to recall some sentimental response there. I think such =
epiphanies more likely to be the rule rather than the exceptions. . =20


More down to earth, I look at the Eiffel Tower and reconstruct in my =
mind's eye the Maughanaclea Hills of West Cork ... or the Beara =
Peninsular ... the great good places ... (too early yet for my calvados, =
Jim).

David Rose
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Dymphna Lonergan=20
To: IR-D[at]JISCMAIL.AC.UK=20
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 8:48 AM
Subject: Re: As though everything I had ever loved and lost...


An Australian friend of mine packed up, left her grown-up children, =
and=20
went to live Donegal about fifteen years ago because on a visit to =
Ireland=20
in the 80s she had a strong feeling that it was her spiritual home. =
She has=20
no Irish ancestry that she knows of.

Sender: The Irish Diaspora Studies List
From: Veronica Summers
Subject: Re: As though everything I had ever loved and lost...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

I suspect that it relates to feelings of longing for home, and possibly security, rather than specifically to Ireland, and often these attachments are buried deep in the subconscious. A few years ago I was in an air emergency over Bulgaria, circling for ages as the plane dumped fuel and prepared to make an emergency landing. Everyone stayed calm, but the only thought that I can remember vividly is that I was wishing that all this was happening at home, that if anything went wrong I'd rather crash into English soil! Being half-Irish by parentage, with a great love of Ireland, and having lived in Wales most of my life, this has puzzled me ever since, but come the crunch it was still the birthplace soil that lured me deep down!

Veronica Summers



-----------------------------------------
Email sent from www.ntlworld.com
Virus-checked using McAfee(R) Software
Visit www.ntlworld.com/security for more information

Sender: The Irish Diaspora Studies List
From: Dymphna Lonergan
Subject: Re: As though everything I had ever loved and lost...
In-Reply-To:
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

An Australian friend of mine packed up, left her grown-up children, and=20
went to live Donegal about fifteen years ago because on a visit to Ireland=
=20
in the 80s she had a strong feeling that it was her spiritual home. She has=
=20
no Irish ancestry that she knows of.




At 19:56 11/09/06 -0500, you wrote:
>Brian, Thanks -- that clarifies things.
>
>Nothing leaps to mind right now as a case of unanticipated "love at first
>sight" with the Irish landscape, etc, except that I know I have heard loads
>and loads of comparable anecdotal accounts. I'd love to hear of other
>memoirs, travel accounts, etc, that include such moments
>
>I suspect-- and this is walking into a speculative stratosphere, I=
realize--
>that it has something to do with the persons who get this surge of
>connection having already imaginatively constructed Ireland as a spiritual
>place, or maybe more precisely as a place where some kind of spiritual
>transformation is possible for them. Whether it's the orthodoxies of Bishop
>Spalding's "Religious Mission of the Irish People" (1880) or the cosmic
>surfings of today's New Age Celts, the idea floating around the world that
>Ireland has a distinctly spiritual cast seems indestructible.
>
>For the record, I haven't touched a drop tonight. You should hear the kind
>of vaporings I can produce along these lines after a couple of glasses of
>wine!
>
>Jim Rogers
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Patrick O'Sullivan [mailto:P.OSullivan[at]bradford.ac.uk]
>Sent: Monday, September 11, 2006 8:12 AM
>To: IR-D[at]JISCMAIL.AC.UK
>Subject: [IR-D] As though everything I had ever loved and lost...
>
>From: Brian Lambkin [mailto:Brian.Lambkin[at]magni.org.uk]
>Sent: 11 September 2006 14:13
>Subject: RE: [IR-D] As though everything I had ever loved and lost...
>
>Thanks to Tom and Jim for their comments.
>What struck me in particular was the idea that the 'first sighting' of a
>place (in this case Ireland),whether from land, sea, or air (as in this
>case), could trigger an overwhelming emotional response. This is
>understandable in the case of a returned emigrant, or descendant of an
>emigrant, but Holmquist's case seems remarkable because she had no previous
>connection with Ireland.
>Brian
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Rogers, James [mailto:JROGERS[at]stthomas.edu]
>Sent: 08 September 2006 19:53
>Subject: RE: [IR-D] As though everything I had ever loved and lost...
>
>Brian, I am not entirely sure which part of Holmquist's remarks you are
>asking about--but if you mean the idea that Ireland is somehow uniquely
>comprehensive of a larger human experience of loss, that sounds familiar
>enough; I seem to recall something much along those lines in Rebecca
>Solnit's "The Book of Migrations: Some Passages in Ireland" (1997).
>
>I'm going to have dig out that article -- sounds intersting
>
>Jim Rogers


le gach dea ghu=ED
Dymphna


Dr Dymphna Lonergan
Professional English Convener
Room 282, Humanities, Flinders University
(08) 8201 2079

1966-2006
Flinders 40th Anniversary

Research interests: Business English, Plain English, Australian English,=20
Hiberno English, Irish language words in English, Anglo-Irish literature,=20
Irish Australian literature

Sender: The Irish Diaspora Studies List
From: "padraic.finn"
Subject: Re: As though everything I had ever loved and lost...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Am I the only one who feels that this whole discussion is a bit sentimental
and a tad self indulgent?

Padraic Finn
----- Original Message -----
From: "D.C. Rose"
To:
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 10:08 AM
Subject: Re: [IR-D] As though everything I had ever loved and lost...


We must not undervalue the power of the literary imagination. I remind you
of Nabokov's reply when asked if he knew Dublin: 'As well as anyone can ...
who has never been there'. One does not have to be an Italian to embrace
Venice or Greek to be moved at the first sight of the Acropolis. Has any
one read Heinrich Boll's Irischer Tagebuch lately? I seem to recall some
sentimental response there. I think such epiphanies more likely to be the
rule rather than the exceptions. .


More down to earth, I look at the Eiffel Tower and reconstruct in my mind's
eye the Maughanaclea Hills of West Cork ... or the Beara Peninsular ... the
great good places ... (too early yet for my calvados, Jim).

David Rose
----- Original Message -----
From: Dymphna Lonergan
To: IR-D[at]JISCMAIL.AC.UK
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 8:48 AM
Subject: Re: As though everything I had ever loved and lost...


An Australian friend of mine packed up, left her grown-up children, and
went to live Donegal about fifteen years ago because on a visit to Ireland
in the 80s she had a strong feeling that it was her spiritual home. She
has
no Irish ancestry that she knows of.

Sender: The Irish Diaspora Studies List
From: Maureen Mannion
Subject: Re: As though everything I had ever loved and lost...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=response
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi Ultan,
Yes, I think Pauric is a bit negative, but I believe, his comments are
consistent with his previous remark about 'romanticising' Ireland. Perhaps
it's due to my 'jaundiced view' of Ireland, as you call it, I found these
comments hard to relate to as well, and a bit sentimental. That said, I
know of and respect the spiritual 'call' of a place. Santa Barbara had and
still has that for me.
Talk soon.
Maureen

----- Original Message -----
From: "padraic.finn"
To:
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 3:37 PM
Subject: Re: [IR-D] As though everything I had ever loved and lost...


>
> Am I the only one who feels that this whole discussion is a bit
> sentimental and a tad self indulgent?
>
> Padraic Finn
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "D.C. Rose"
> To:
> Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 10:08 AM
> Subject: Re: [IR-D] As though everything I had ever loved and lost...
>
>
> We must not undervalue the power of the literary imagination. I remind
> you of Nabokov's reply when asked if he knew Dublin: 'As well as anyone
> can ... who has never been there'. One does not have to be an Italian to
> embrace Venice or Greek to be moved at the first sight of the Acropolis.
> Has any one read Heinrich Boll's Irischer Tagebuch lately? I seem to
> recall some sentimental response there. I think such epiphanies more
> likely to be the rule rather than the exceptions. .
>
>
> More down to earth, I look at the Eiffel Tower and reconstruct in my
> mind's eye the Maughanaclea Hills of West Cork ... or the Beara Peninsular
> ... the great good places ... (too early yet for my calvados, Jim).
>
> David Rose
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Dymphna Lonergan
> To: IR-D[at]JISCMAIL.AC.UK
> Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 8:48 AM
> Subject: Re: As though everything I had ever loved and lost...
>
>
> An Australian friend of mine packed up, left her grown-up children, and
> went to live Donegal about fifteen years ago because on a visit to
> Ireland
> in the 80s she had a strong feeling that it was her spiritual home. She
> has
> no Irish ancestry that she knows of.
>

Sender: The Irish Diaspora Studies List
From: "Rogers, James"
Subject: Re: As though everything I had ever loved and lost...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain

Well, yes and no. I appreciate the concern about self-indulgence, and trust
our ever-judicious moderators to rein us in if we get gooey.

But I think the question of what, exactly, lies behind the popular
fascination with Ireland is entirely pertinent to Irish Studies (and
absorbing). I have no doubt that the tourism planners and marketing
whiz-kids of Bord Failte et al are busy trying to elicit, and evaluate,
precisely these sorts of responses, in completely unsentimental ways.

Jim R

-----Original Message-----
From: padraic.finn [mailto:padraic.finn[at]BTINTERNET.COM]
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 5:38 PM
To: IR-D[at]JISCMAIL.AC.UK
Subject: Re: [IR-D] As though everything I had ever loved and lost...

Am I the only one who feels that this whole discussion is a bit sentimental
and a tad self indulgent?

Padraic Finn
----- Original Message -----
From: "D.C. Rose"
To:
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 10:08 AM
Subject: Re: [IR-D] As though everything I had ever loved and lost...


We must not undervalue the power of the literary imagination. I remind you
of Nabokov's reply when asked if he knew Dublin: 'As well as anyone can ...
who has never been there'. One does not have to be an Italian to embrace
Venice or Greek to be moved at the first sight of the Acropolis. Has any
one read Heinrich Boll's Irischer Tagebuch lately? I seem to recall some
sentimental response there. I think such epiphanies more likely to be the
rule rather than the exceptions. .


More down to earth, I look at the Eiffel Tower and reconstruct in my mind's
eye the Maughanaclea Hills of West Cork ... or the Beara Peninsular ... the
great good places ... (too early yet for my calvados, Jim).

David Rose
----- Original Message -----
From: Dymphna Lonergan
To: IR-D[at]JISCMAIL.AC.UK
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 8:48 AM
Subject: Re: As though everything I had ever loved and lost...


An Australian friend of mine packed up, left her grown-up children, and
went to live Donegal about fifteen years ago because on a visit to Ireland
in the 80s she had a strong feeling that it was her spiritual home. She
has
no Irish ancestry that she knows of.

Sender: The Irish Diaspora Studies List
From: Liam Clarke
Subject: Re: As though everything I had ever loved and lost...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I don't know Padraic: apparently some people are willing to die for the
place

Liam Clarke=20

-----Original Message-----
From: The Irish Diaspora Studies List [mailto:IR-D[at]JISCMAIL.AC.UK] On
Behalf Of padraic.finn
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 11:38 PM
To: IR-D[at]JISCMAIL.AC.UK
Subject: Re: [IR-D] As though everything I had ever loved and lost...

Am I the only one who feels that this whole discussion is a bit
sentimental and a tad self indulgent?

Padraic Finn
----- Original Message -----
From: "D.C. Rose"
To:
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 10:08 AM
Subject: Re: [IR-D] As though everything I had ever loved and lost...


We must not undervalue the power of the literary imagination. I remind
you=20
of Nabokov's reply when asked if he knew Dublin: 'As well as anyone can
...=20
who has never been there'. One does not have to be an Italian to
embrace=20
Venice or Greek to be moved at the first sight of the Acropolis. Has
any=20
one read Heinrich Boll's Irischer Tagebuch lately? I seem to recall
some=20
sentimental response there. I think such epiphanies more likely to be
the=20
rule rather than the exceptions. .


More down to earth, I look at the Eiffel Tower and reconstruct in my
mind's=20
eye the Maughanaclea Hills of West Cork ... or the Beara Peninsular ...
the=20
great good places ... (too early yet for my calvados, Jim).

David Rose
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Dymphna Lonergan
To: IR-D[at]JISCMAIL.AC.UK
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 8:48 AM
Subject: Re: As though everything I had ever loved and lost...


An Australian friend of mine packed up, left her grown-up children,
and
went to live Donegal about fifteen years ago because on a visit to
Ireland
in the 80s she had a strong feeling that it was her spiritual home.
She=20
has
no Irish ancestry that she knows of.

Sender: The Irish Diaspora Studies List
From: "Morgan, John Matthew"
Subject: As though
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Unfortunately, we never know if we're being overly imaginative or
sentimental. The first time I was in southern France, north of
Marseilles, I had an absolute sense of deep familiarity, of having known
this land before, these hills, of my presence being "right" here. More
so than I have ever felt in the US or Ireland or anywhere else. Yet I am
not sentimental about there at all and never think much about the area
when I'm not there. To my astonishment I was watching TV years after
being there and an actress was being interviewed--I don't even recall
who. She said she had recently returned from shooting a film in the area
north of Marseilles and near Aix en Provence and that she was stunned by
a strange feeling of being "back" there, a homelike feeling.
There may be some DNA factor in all this.

JM
=20

Sender: The Irish Diaspora Studies List
From: Patrick O'Sullivan
Subject: Diasporas, Migration and Identities Programme,
Postgraduate Event: 13 and 14 December 2006, University of Leeds
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Forwarded on behalf of...

Katie Roche [mailto:K.A.Roche[at]leeds.ac.uk]=20

Diasporas, Migration and Identities Programme
Postgraduate Event: 13 and 14 December 2006, University of Leeds
=A0
A postgraduate conference will take place in association with the =
Diasporas,
Migration and Identities Programme in December this year.=A0 Information =
about
the event is below.=A0 If you are interested in attending please would =
you
email me and I will send you a registration form.=A0 If you are =
intending to
stay overnight in university accommodation, I need to know soon as there =
is
a limited number of rooms available.
=A0
The conference will begin with registration and coffee followed by a =
keynote
speaker on 13 December, and will end on 14 December with closing remarks =
by
Professor Kim Knott, the Programme Director.=A0 There will be workshops,
discussion and short papers on subjects including the following:=20
=A0
=95 Connection of Nigerian diaspora with homeland online
=95 Curry culture or cultural fusion? Indian culture in Italy
=95 =93Fishers of men not distributors of fish in tins=94 =96 the =
Friends Relief
Service in Germany after the Second World War
=95 Heterogeneous narratives of exile and identity from Turkish and =
Greek
Cypriot refugees in Cyprus and London
=95 Migration, representation and identities: the construction of the
sexualised female body in discourses of Paradise
=95 The cultural politics of identity: film, television and immigration =
in
post-war Britain
=95 Tourism and African diaspora: the interpretation of a contested =
world
heritage site in Ghana, Elmina Castle
=95 Who is Dorcas? Women of the Windrush Generation
=A0
The reception and dinner on the first evening, and coffee and lunch on =
both
days will be provided free of charge, but there will be a registration =
fee
of =A320.=A0 Accommodation and travel costs must be met by the =
participants
themselves.
=A0
I look forward to hearing from you.
=A0
Katie Roche
AHRC Programme Administrator
Diasporas, Migration and Identities
Address: Theology and Religious Studies, University of Leeds LS2 9JT
Tel: +44 113 3437838
Fax: +44 113 3433654
email: k.a.roche[at]leeds.ac.uk
http://www.diasporas.ac.uk
=A0
=A0
=A0

Sender: The Irish Diaspora Studies List
From: Cymru66[at]AOL.COM
Subject: Re: As though everything I had ever loved and lost...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

I must admit to find this discussion a bit sentimental for one that is about
scholarly discourse. I know my late husband, John Hickey, would have cringe
to see this.

Susan Hickey

Sender: The Irish Diaspora Studies List
From: "William Mulligan Jr."
Subject: Re: As though everything I had ever loved and lost...
In-Reply-To:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I am not sure what aspects of the discussion, which has really been =
quite
brief, people find overly sentimental and inappropriate for a scholarly
list. =20

One of the themes within the Diaspora has been a sense of longing and =
exile
from Ireland among those who left, who often passed on to their children =
and
grandchildren an idealized view of Ireland, certainly a view frozen at =
the
time they left. Irish identities formed within the Diaspora generally =
had
no direct connection to Ireland. It existed for subsequent generations =
as
an idealized image, a place from which people had been cut off. This =
sense
of longing and exile has been developed in both scholarly discourse and =
in
literature and seems like fair game to discuss. Some of us are both
scholars of the Diaspora and members of it - so the line can be blurred.
And, as someone pointed out, there have been people willing to die for
Ireland. From Young Ireland, at least, forward there has been a strand =
of
highly romantic ideas about the land of Ireland and its power. This, =
too,
appears in literature as well. So there seem to be a range of =
legitimate
questions about the images of Ireland among the Diaspora and how people
react when their idealized image comes into contact with the reality of
Ireland. =20

Among the group I study, the Irish in Michigan's Copper Country, there =
were
many programs and performances with "Irish" themes that drew large
audiences. I use the quotation marks because over time many of the =
musical
pieces were from Tin Pan Alley not Ireland and were highly sentimental =
in
theme, as were many of the presentations about Ireland, -- but they had
strong appeal to Irish Americans. That phenomenon is certainly worth
discussing as well. =20

Bill Mulligan

William H. Mulligan, Jr., Ph.D.
Professor of History
Murray State University
Murray KY 42071-3341 USA=20
=20
=20

Sender: The Irish Diaspora Studies List
From: "Morgan, John Matthew"
Subject: As though
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I think the divide here is the familiar one between the Irish and the
Irish-Americans. The in-Ireland Irish cannot bear this kind of thing.
For their benefit, let's drop it.

Jack Morgan